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[Jan. 21st, 2021|12:25 pm]
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Parasts pārmetums sazvērestības teorētiķiem ir saistīts ar viņu lētticību un viņu vēlmi meklēt mierinājumu savā sapratnē par pasauli. Patlaban es teiktu, ka šī kritika labāk attiecas uz tiem, kuri tic, ka pēc vakcinācijas, viss būs labi, un mēs mierīgi varēsim atgriesties vecajā normalitātē.
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From:[info]ulvs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 12:29 pm
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Es vēlētos saprast, kāpēc pēc vakcīnas un bara imunitātes iegūšanas mēs neatgriezīsimies normālajās sliedēs? Tas ir skaidrs, ka pasaule mainās, mainoties tehnoloģijām un ideoloģijām. Kāpēc to ir tik grūti pieņemt? Tāpēc, ka tik ilgi ssam dzīvojuši "vecajā pasaulē"?
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 12:37 pm
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jo būs jaunas mutācijas, un līdz ar to, jaunās vakcinas, un kamēr gaidām tās, jaunie ierobežojumi, lai gatavotu mūs jaunājā pasaulē. Arhitekti būs WEF dalibnieki - bēt ja tev tās ir viegli pieņemt, tad nebūs problēmas.
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From:[info]ulvs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:20 pm
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Nez, esmu ļoti pārliecināts, ka būs liela pretestība, ja šis viss vilksies ilgāk pār vēl pus gadu. Saprotu par mutācijām. Naivi ceru, ka cilvēki vienkārši ilgāk neizturēs un būs līderi, kuri vienos tās balsis, kuras teiks- mēs esam gatavi mirt par mūsu veco dzīvesveidu. Mēs esam gatavi tam, ka noteiktās demogrāfijas grupās būs lielāka mirstība. Mēs neesam radīti tik ilgi būt nošķirti cits no cita.

Šādu pretestību organizēt nemaz nebūtu grūti. Vismaz t.s. demokrātiskajās valstīs.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:28 pm
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Man liekās, ka būs ļoti grūti organizēt, jo musu valdība seko instrukcijām no augšas (I'm past caring how that sounds). Jebkurš populists (kā Gobzems piemēram), būs mērķis (easy target practice for the media and 'intelligent ones').

The only way out is the classical Latvian one: low-key civil disobedience and natural distrust of authority.
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From:[info]ulvs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:30 pm
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Ja šādai kustībai būs būt, tad tā nebūs caur populismu un meliem, bet cilvēcību un patiesību.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:42 pm
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cilvēcība un patiesība tiks iskatītas, ka populisma un meli
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From:[info]dzeltens
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 05:58 pm
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low-key civil disobedience and natural distrust of authority: šis mani šobrīd reāli glābj, dzīvoju, it kā nekādas sūda pandēmijas nebūtu, nezinu gan par ilgtermiņā.
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From:[info]extranjero
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 12:45 pm
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Es esmu tas naivais, kurš cer, ka pēc vakcinācijas tiešām viss atgriezīsies normālajās sliedēs. Bet kaut kā nepamet šī sajūta, ka es vienkārši esmu naivs. Parasti tā dzīvē vienmēr ir bijis, ka manas cerības ir izrādījušās ļoti naivas. Tāpēc pieņemu, ka tā ir arī šoreiz.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 12:56 pm
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Diemžēl, man liekas, ka esi (kaut arī mēs visi esam zinamā merā). Man, tomēr, ir pesimistisks raksturs, kas nozīmē, ka bieži grib meklēt visssliktāko jebkurā situācījā. Ir jāņem manu personību verā :)
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From:[info]smejmoon
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 12:35 pm
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Tas tak visiem normāliem cilvēkiem piemīt.?
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 12:39 pm
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Neesmu parliecināts, ka saprotu.
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From:[info]smejmoon
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 12:57 pm
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lētticība un vēlme meklēt mierinājumu manuprāt ir vienmērīgi un plaši izplatīta, neatkarīgi no tā vai tās ir konspirāciju teorijas vai meinstrīms.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:02 pm
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Tieši tā - tikai es uzskatu, ka patlaban (un par 'šo'), ši vēlme ir stiprāka meinstrīmos - gandrīz reliģiskā limeņos.
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From:[info]kakjux
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:19 pm
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man vispār liekas, ka pēc vakcinācijas viss atkal mainīsies un varbūt atdos vairāk lietu dzīvē, ko darīt. bet es neticu, ka viss atgriezīsies kā bija pirms. pārāk daudz lietu in generic society mindset ir mainījies, lai viss "atgrieztos vecajā".
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:21 pm
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Ko tu domā paliks no vecās pasaules?
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From:[info]kakjux
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:24 pm
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besis vienam uz otru? :D bet, ja godīgi un nopietni, es neuzdrošinos pat minēt, too many variables.
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From:[info]ulvs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:26 pm
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Nu nu, kas ir mainījies vidējā pāķlatvietī? Ja ne pieaugušas viņa alkas un stiprināta viņa nostaļģija pēc vecā. Cilvēki (teiksim, mītiskie jaunās pazaules arhitekti) nenovērtē pūļa spēku.

Vienīgais jaunās pasaules scenārijs, kādu spēju iztēloties darbojamies,ir tas, kur visiem pilsoņiem ir universal basic income vai kā to sauc (kad valsts visiem izmaksā noteiktu naudu katru mēnesi).
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:31 pm
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Un not tā, Ulvi, ir verdzība, reāla verdzība, jo līdz ar to būs ļoti viegli veikt 'social credit system'. UIB būs atkarīgs no uzvedības.
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From:[info]snauts
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 01:45 pm
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Un man likās, ka es jau 20 gadus nodarbojos ar wage slavery.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:44 pm
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Jā, bet gan tev gan man ir iespējas (zinamā merā) aizbēgt vai izvairīties no tā, un atrast nelielu neatkarību.
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From:[info]snauts
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:59 pm
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Man liekas, ka ja cilvēkam ir kāda reta un pieprasīta prasme, tad viņš jebkuru sistēmu var gamblēt, savukārt ja nav, tad tevi ekspluatēs jebkurā sistēmā.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 03:04 pm
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jā jā, bet soc kreditu sistēmā iespējas kustēties būs ierobežotākas. Turklāt 4 ind revolucijas ietvaros, prasmes, kas ļaus mums gamblēt saruks.
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From:[info]snauts
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 03:13 pm
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Don't be such a Debbie Downer. A bet varbūt būs karš.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 03:15 pm
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viss iespējams
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 04:06 pm
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Ir arī opcija atrast nelielu atkarību. Teiksim, dzert regulāri alu.
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From:[info]ulvs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 04:48 pm
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Atkarīgs no tā, kā tā sistēma darbojas. Spēju saskatīt gan potenciālu social credit system un verdzību, gan arī brīvību cilvēkiem, kuri šobrīd reāli vergo par kapeikām.
From:[info]riobravo
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:17 pm
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Parunasim labak par lielajiem jautajumiem. Parmainas vienmer bijusas un tas vienmer ir sapigas, par to Buda macija un noteikti daudzi pirms vina. Pajat viruss, nebutu tas, butu kaut kas cits, bet kopbilde diemzel butu tiesi tada pati. Kas man ciba visvairak nepatik ir ka te ir pilns ar cietejiem kuri vel iedrosina viens otru, jo parmainam var pieiet ari citadak.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:52 pm
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Jā, tev taisnība... bet, man liekas, ka vajag ņemt verā kas ir pārmaiņu arhitekti, lai saprastu to, ko tas varētu mums nozīmēt.
From:[info]riobravo
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 08:35 pm
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Varu tikai ieteikt nemeginat visu saprast, ipasi to, kur ir skaidrs, ka nekas labs nav gaidams (unless tev par to maksa naudu). Nesen liku so linku pie viena cita cibina bet te ari iederetos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJ8aRl1UNgw
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 09:06 pm
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sweetheart/young man, you are sorely mistaken if you think I am going to watch a Youtube video of an extrovert Yank explaining the Dunning-Kruger Effect.

This is Ciba, and in my Ciba I will give my thoughts, opinions, and farts on a range of matters. If anyone thinks I am talking out of my arse, they are entitled to let me know - which they often do. I ain't blocked anyone, yet.

In this case, your suggestion seems to be not to look into anything if I don't expect to find anything good. Thanks, but if I had taken this advice I wouldn't, for example, had learned how the banking system works. It is rather depressing, but I am glad I know. Some people just want to know.
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From:[info]gnidrologs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 09:40 pm
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this guy is an epitome of 'sheeple'
From:[info]riobravo
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 10:04 pm
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Ja esi kompetents kaut viena tema, piemeram par banku sistemu, tad tas jau nozime, ka saproti, kas ir kompetence. Cilveki kas mak kompetenci un tai pat laika nesaprot limitus man ir lielaka mikla. Runa nav par to vai "drikst" but viedoklis bet vai "vajag".
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 10:06 pm
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Jesus wept. This is Ciba. Where in God's name do you think you are?
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 10:09 pm
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And while I am here, when it comes to the thrust of this post - the changes taking place due to the 4th Industrial Revolution and the Great Reset that has been touted by the Great and the Good - you tell me which part of that 'thesis' is the most convincing/hardest to discount?
From:[info]riobravo
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 10:27 pm
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Neesmu dross ka sapratu, vari uzrakstit vienkarsak?
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 10:29 pm
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But you can understand youtube videos in English?
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 10:33 pm
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Okay, in brief:
1) The conspiracy theory is that there is a deliberate attempt to engineer a Great Reset in order to adjust society to the effects of the 4th Industrial Revolution.
2) This involves for example people not owning anything anymore, and is brought to you by the members of the WEF - the biggest and most influential corporations on the planet.
3) The lockdowns and restrictions help bring this about.
4) I assume you have looked into this, and I get the feeling you are not convinced by it. If so, could you tell me, however, which aspect of this theory was the most convincing/hardest to discount?
From:[info]riobravo
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 11:38 pm
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Industrial revolution, people not owning anything, most influential corporations, lockdowns and restrictions - sie aspekti ir loti parliecinosi, jo tie patiesam eksiste un notiek.

Problema ir ar "deliberate attempt" dalu. Vai tas nozime speciali raditu virusu? Speciali raditus negodpratigus ierobezojumus?
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:05 am
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Par virusu, es nezinu - par negodpartigus ierobežojumus, es personģi esmu arvien pārliecinātāks jo sekas tām ir graujoši - it īpaši kad pastāv citi veidi tikt galā ar šo virusu.

Starp citu, tu vari skatīties uz visu-iemeslu mirstību, lai saprastu cik šis virus ir briesmīgs. Tādā veidā nav jāstrīdas par to, vai kāds nomira no Covid vai no kaut ka cita. Virusa iespaids būs skaidrāks.
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:19 pm
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Still no lockdown in Sweden. Why do "they" spare us?

Can you imagine, I can freely do all of these things: go shopping, eat and drink at restaurants, bars and cafes, go to the gym, travel by bus, subway and train, walk anywhere I want at any given time. Well, I choose to not do some of these things, or do them less, but nobody is forcing me. There are some restrictions, yes. For example, no alcohol served after 8pm, shops have to designate threshhold for how many customers are allowed inside simultaneously, masks are recommended in public transport 7-9am and 4-6pm. To be honest, I have not felt effect of any of of these restrictions so far - I noticed that they were counting incoming people at the entrance of Systembolaget (state-owned booze shop), but there was no cue.

But still some fuckwits try to present this as "Sweden changing its strategy"...

Anyway, no reset of your description seems to be happening here, so I guess I am safe! =)
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:32 pm
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liels prieks to dzirdēt!
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:46 pm
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Čīrz, meit! But do you have any answer to my question? =P
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 02:40 pm
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No. I will have to think about it. Maybe you can help? Why is Sweden being so pragmatic compared to the rest of Western and Central Europe? Are there possibly non-pc reasons (for example not wishing to police lockdown measures on immigrant communities)? Maybe Sweden is already along way along to being the kind of society that befits - in the eyes of the technocrat - the 4th Industrial Revoltion - for example is Sweden not predominantly cashless now? Would Swedes already be ready to accept microchipping and annual covid-vaccinations, and biometric passports etcetera? What about the economic set up in Sweden? Do small businesses less able to survive a lockdown constitute a small or large proportion of the economy?

Knowing the answer to these kinds of questions might help me understand (or fit it into a narrative).
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 04:03 pm
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I think one reason for no lockdowns here is that it is legally impossible. Not even with the new "pandemic law". They would need to amend the constitutional laws, and in order to do that they need 2 approvals by the parliament with elections in-between. Next parliamentary elections are scheduled for 2022.

Regarding cash, yes, Sweden is very much cashless, but not in any enforced way. You can use cash, people just simply choose to not use it (including myself). That said, if I remember correctly, the official guidance material "if war or crisis comes" mentions the necessity to keep some cash at home.

I have absolutely no idea about microchipping so I would say that topic is not in the media discourse. Vaccinations - in general the public is rather positive, but I think the latest statistics for covid vaccine support were a bit less encouraging. Still, FHM & Tegnell repeatedly stress that any vaccinations have to be voluntary.

Biometric passports - no idea, but are all EU passports not biometric already?

Without any reference to statistics I would say that there are quite a lot of small businesses, and many people have some part-time businesses besides their regular jobs as well. The cafe I mention in my Ciba is a small business. Actually I might be starting my own soon, apparently there is some state support available for unemployed dudes like me who have a somewhat feasible business idea...
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From:[info]begemots
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 11:49 pm
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Especially since considering claims of the Dunning-Kruger effect are thought to be just due to errors in original research.
From:[info]fedrs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:21 pm
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Jā, ik pa laikam ienāk prātā doma, ka viss, jāgriež vēnas. Bet tad saņemos un iestāstu sev, ka jātic zinātnei - gan zinātnieki izgudros veidu, kā darīt sev galu ātri, nesāpīgi un bez dramatiskām ainām citiem.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 02:48 pm
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gan es gan mana sieva nebija pilnīgi pārliecināts ko Tu gribēja teikt :)
From:[info]fedrs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 03:02 pm
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Man tagad ar to būs jādzīvo :(
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 03:07 pm
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Okay tadā gadījumā esmu izlēmis saprast to tumšāko variantu.
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 04:05 pm
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"There is no such thing in life as normal"

(c) Morrissey
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 04:09 pm
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kurā dziesmā?
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:09 am
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Mērci - not one of his best imho.
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 11:55 am
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Nav gan. Bet nu citāts man iegūlās smadzenēs. Jo tam es arī piekrītu, nekā normāla šajā pasaulē nav, šeit ir trakonams! =)
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From:[info]begemots
Date:January 21st, 2021 - 11:52 pm
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Mēs nezinām kā būs.

Mēs varam modelēt, kas būs citādāk, ja viss notiek pēc tā nosacītā plāna, kas nu šobrīd skaitās strādājošs.

Proti, līdz gada vidum vakcinē visus kas ir ar mieru, un vīrusa izplatība nokrītas zem pandēmijas līmeņa.

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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:09 am
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Varbūt krītis jo bus vasara ;) Varbūt arī ši iemēsla dēļ: https://www.who.int/news/item/20-01-2021-who-information-notice-for-ivd-users-2020-05
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From:[info]begemots
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:34 am
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that wasn't my point :)

I meant that if you would like to model future, I would invite you to propose which things would change, if covid is dealt with.

let's just assume it will be, for a moment.

let's imagine the cases drop to 0 by mid February. you think we would not go back to pretty much the way it was before? what would be change them, in your opinion?
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From:[info]begemots
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:36 am
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un jā, šo es lasīju pirms 2-3 nedēļām.

citiem vārdiem sakot, jo vairāk reizes skanē paraugu uz covid, jo lielākas iespējas uz false positive, vai ne?

which by itself gives us perfectly nothing until we know what threshold is set to in Latvia.
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From:[info]brookings
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 10:00 am
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"which by itself gives us perfectly nothing until we know what threshold is set to in Latvia."

Yeah, I wanted to know this. I couldn't find any info on it. I asked around (a bit) - no dice. I know they reduced it in Ireland, and hey presto, cases fell. If I were a paid-up journo, this would be the kind of question I would be asking, but they don't seem to do this anymore.
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From:[info]mapats
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 10:04 am
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Gan jau pasaule sadalīsies nometnēs, pakaros un liksies mierā uz kādiem 50 gadiem, vai pārsimts gadiem, atkarībā no kara smaguma. Mana vēlme un ceriba, lai mana dzīvesvieta, beigās, atrodas tajā daļā, kas nav zem korporācijām un kur nenotiek karadarbība. Ir potenciāls karstajām ziepēm sākties šogad, jo daļa varžu vairs nevēlas tikt vārīta nekādā veidā. P.s. varžu pieminēšana nav atsauce uz frančiem.
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:22 pm
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Es ļoti ceru, ka nekāds karš nebūs.
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From:[info]mapats
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:38 pm
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Nevis ceri, bet b dari kautko, lai nebūtu. Ar cerētājiem gulagā krāsnis kurināja.
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:44 pm
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Dari kaut ko?
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From:[info]mapats
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 12:49 pm
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Savu iespēju un saprašanas apmēra. Vislabāk klusām nevienam neko nesakot, tik ar domubiedriem bīdot lietas. Manas nepamatotās aizdomas saka, ka būs.
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 01:19 pm
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Kas ir tas "kaut kas", ko man vajadzētu darīt?
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From:[info]mapats
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 01:53 pm
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A ko tu vari?
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 02:36 pm
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Domāt, analizēt, rakstīt, tulkot. Tas tā, sākumam.
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From:[info]mapats
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 02:54 pm
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Vai vari izdomāt un uzrakstīt kautko, lai tiem, kuriem ir iespēja sūtīt savas valsts karavīrus pret citas valsts karavīriem, savus policistus un karavīrus pret savas valsts neapmierinātajām iedzīvotājiem, šāda vēlme pārietu. Un pārtulkot piemēram dāniski, jo pie viņiem policisti sākuši sist ar stekiem protestētājus. Varbūt vari izdomāt arī kādu labāku pielietojumu savām spējām.
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From:[info]mranarhs
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 03:52 pm
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Es neprotu dāņu valodu.

Es pats netaisos karot.
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From:[info]mapats
Date:January 22nd, 2021 - 03:18 pm
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