Sorry, bet ticami tikai tiem, kuri par visām varēm cenšas ticēt pretrunīgajam.

+

Ticeet pretruniigajam, it esiibas priekshnoteikums.

Tā būtu interesanta sarunu tēma. Visādā ziņā, ja arī ir kas pretrunīgs manā esamībā, tad man tā nešķiet. 🤷

Tā pilnīgi noteikti ir. Atceramies, ka Sātana lielākais triks ir pārliecināt masas, ka viņa nav. Mūsdienās cilvēki attaisno ļaunumu uz tā bāzes, ka tāda ļaunuma nemaz nav ergo visas amorālās utilitārisma, konsekvenciālisma, scietismisma ētikas teorijas. Lai varētu darīt JEBKO un pateikt, ka tas ir labi, vai sliktākajā gadījumā, relatīvi.

Tas, ka cilvēki pārņemti ar nelabo jau ir redzams kaut vai no viņu uzvedības. Atceramies to fanātismu vaxxeru aprindās, kas bija gatavi slodzīt nevaxētos lēģeros, jo viņu kungi tā teica. Redzam visus tos woke ībļus, kas izskatās un uzvedās kā monstri un fanātiski kalpo 2+2=5 reliģijai. Skatāmies uz mūsu politiķiem un pakalpojošiem medijiem, kas visi unisonā bliež vienu un to pašu NWO sūdu gadiem, kamēr apzināti grūž mūsu ekonomikas, kultūras un demogrāfijas ar vien lielākā postā. Skatāmies uz to pašu bērnu seksualizēšanu, kas viņiem tik ļoti svarīga nez kāpēc (everyone needs to be MKUltra victim).
Mēs dzīvojam sūdīgos laikos. Golden calf, Baal/Moloch & Baphomet worship era. Mēs tam ejam cauri ne pirmo reizi. Ne velti mūsu senči par to ir atstājuši brīdinājuma vēstis. Bet mēs nemācamies. Man(or woman) is not a learning animal.

To ir gruuti ietilpinaat pauriitii :( Bet it seems more and more credible.. Es arii domaaju varbuut lietas, kas shkjiet too cruel to comntemplate, like beernu slimiibas un kaut kas vispar nesaistiits ar tieshu ljaunpraatiibu, ir cilveeku izraisiits, tur visaadu eksperimentu ar dabisko rezultaataa, taa pati kjiimija visur, etc. Ugh!!!

Sarkasms? Jeb tu to tiešām nopietni?

I mean, kādi eksperimenti pirms 500 gadiem? Kādi cilvēku izraisīti vulkānu izvirdumi pirms 1000? Pirms 2000 un vairāk? Tehnoloģijas vēl tagad nav tik jaudīgas.

Bērnu mirstība ir samazinājusies tikai pēdējos pārsimt gados. Un daudzi no viņiem nomira dzemdību laikā, kad vēl par zinātni neko nezināja un par ateismu varēja nonākt uz kāķa. Daudzi nomira pirmajos dzīvības mēnešos, mocīdamies nepārstājamās sāpēs, jo anestēzija vēl nebija.

Lapsenes, kuras gadu tūkstošiem dēj oliņas dzīvās vabolēs, un kuru kāpuri pēc tam izēd vaboles no iekšas?

Nav nedaudz par šerpu mainīt atbildīgos pēkšņi tad, kad cilvēki ir sākuši varēt tikt ar to visu kaut nedaudz galā?

Ja pieņem, ka dzīvojam kalī jūgas astes galā, kur visi cilvēku grēki akumulējušies līdz breaking point, tas nemaz nešķiet neloģiski. Jūgas ilgst 10k+ gadu. Mūsu dokumentētā vēsture pēc vēdu kalendāra laikam ir pēdējie laiki. Tu, protams, tam netici, but hū kērs kam tic neticīgie.

Interesants mikslis tev sanāk. Kristība ar hinduismu. Vismaz viena no šīm reliģijām otru noliedz. 🤷‍♂️

No breaking point viedokļa sanāk vēl interesantāk, jo agrāk, kad cilvēki bija, pēc tavas tēzes, mazāk grēku uzkrājuši, dabas katastrofas bija daudz bīstamākas -- gan cilvēki mazāk zināja, kā tās paredzēt, gan iespējas palīdzēt bija mazākas.

Bet jebkurā gadījumā sākuma punkts gan bija par to, ka ciešanām tiek pakļautas nevainīgas būtnes. Ir tikušas pakļautas visus šos iepriekšējos laikmetus un joprojām tiek pakļautas.

Un tikai mazu daļu no tā var novelt uz cilvēkiem, kuri turklāt cenšas daļu no šīm ciešanām atvieglot vai likvidēt.

The simple truth is that we know for a fact that humans have messed things up in past, present and will in the future. We do not know to what an extent God has ever messed things up. So for me it is indeed more credible that even the most unthinkable bad stuff might potentially be due to human mess-up and neglect, rather than God's. God intended the world to be a paradise, but we all know that humans had different agenda.

The simple truth is that world has much more stuff that is not under control of humans.

The capability of humans to mess things up is tiny. We can kill ourselves in extinction, but the world will continue. With other animals doing unspeakable things to each other in the "perfect" world created by god.

As regards god, insofar as you admit that god is omnipotent and omnipresent, he has the ultimate responsibility for whatever he has created, including things that are not effect of human behaviour.

Your constant wish to absolve god of responsibility and to put it all on shoulders of humans is admirable.

It reminds very directly the way Germans idolized Hitler. After all, Hitler didn't kill a single Jew himself. However, for some reason we hold him the main responsible for Holocaust. This doesn't reduce the guilt of each individual Nazi, but there is a direct and clear responsibility of the ultimate leader.

The capability of humans to mess things up is tiny? Now, a claim like that is darkly admirable to me? And the fact how easily you and probably all humans abdicate their responsibility.

The uncomfortable truth is that bad things a lot of times don't just happen to us, we welcome them by not taking responsibility and avoiding the truth and avoiding putting in effort to fix things and do the right thing.

Of course I can speak only for myself, as I always do, and I know that the bad things that have happended to me are predominantly consequences of my choices, whereas the good things are often some sort of a miracle int he face of all bad choices I have made.

Tsk. The ability of religious people to make humanity (and by consequence themselves) feel important would be endearing, if it wasn't so infantile / sorry, couldn't resist. please forgive me ;) /

I do not abdicate my responsibility, neither that of other humans. As you might have read in my above comment, the fact that Hitler was Nazi leader, doesn't mean that each individual supporter wasn't responsible. What I don't get is that blaming ONLY of supporters, while ignoring the one who BOTH set the rules and apparently has both the OMNISCIENCE and the OMNIPOTENCE to do quite literally whatever he wants.

> The uncomfortable truth is that bad things a lot of times don't just happen to us, we welcome them by not taking responsibility and avoiding the truth

It is very true. However, your "uncomfortable" truth quite comfortably skips around ALL the other stuff that doesn't fit "your own fault" narrative. And I gave you ample examples of that in the previous comments. If god is omnipotent and omniscient, he does (or set in motion) all of the things which we don't. Which includes vast majority of things on Earth. And a lot of which we find incredibly cruel, for example.

As regards the place of humanity in world. Self-aggrandizing by assuming being god's children, while at the same time preaching humility seems pretty phariseic (to use terms of Bible). But each to his own.

Insofar as humanity is concerned, however, knowledge gives us its own version of uncomfortable truth (or approximation of that truth):

"We can take small comfort in one thing. Although right now we don’t worry enough about incoming disaster from Up There, we do worry a lot about home-grown disaster Down Here: nuclear warfare, biological warfare, global warming, pollution, overpopulation, destruction of habitat, burning of the rainforests, and so on. However, there’s no danger that human actions will wipe out the planet. Compared to what nature has already done, and will do again, our activities barely show up. One large meteorite packs more explosive power than all human wars put together, a hypothetical World War III included. One Ice Age changes the climate more than a civilization’s worth of carbon dioxide from car exhausts. As for something like the Deccan Traps … you wouldn’t want to know how nasty the atmosphere could become.

No, we can’t destroy the Earth. We can destroy ourselves."

// "Science of Discworld", Terry Pratchett.