THE question?

If there is no true gender, then are we all just monkeys in dresses or suits?
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Nov. 18th, 2006 at 12:23 pm | | Answer

Comments

How can there be no true gender? I know atleast two :)
Posted by [info]atiitis on Nov. 20th, 2006 at 08:59 am | | Thread | Reply
well gender is socially constructed, thus it is a creation of a certain generation and culture even subcultures, which specify gender roles - how man and woman must act, how they must look - the western culture has so far implemented a two gender model, while other cultures have three or even more accepted genders that don't simply rely on biological sex (which also has 3 manifestation, but hermaphrodites in our culture don't get their own gender), but also on spiritual or individual characteristics...gender is just something that is stuck to the body we receive at birth, but how it is perceived and realized in society varies greatly!
Posted by [info]axa on Nov. 20th, 2006 at 06:23 pm | | Parent | Thread | Reply
I must admit that I began to write an answer to your comment as soon as I read the first part of the first sentence, seeing how the rest of the comment is based on the first assumption. How can gender be socially constructed? It is solely an atribute of the human anatomy! How we perceive it in our global semiosphere and personal Umwelts, that is another question but that doesn't change the objective truth. So I maintain my claim - two genders :)
Posted by [info]atiitis on Nov. 21st, 2006 at 09:29 am | | Parent | Thread | Reply
now you're missing the semiotics, cause in english and particularly in social sciences sex and gender are two difference concepts:
gender - the behavioral, cultural, or psychological traits typically associated with one sex
sex - either of the two major forms of individuals that occur in many species and that are distinguished respectively as female or male especially on the basis of their reproductive organs and structures

...of course what consitutes 'real' is only our own perception and belief, thus your assumption that there are two real gender is also reliable, since it is 'true' to you as an individual and as a product of your society and upbringing :)
Posted by [info]axa on Nov. 21st, 2006 at 09:42 am | | Parent | Thread | Reply
You got me there ;)
Thanks for giving me insight into this. Talking to a professional can be so rewarding =)
Posted by [info]atiitis on Nov. 21st, 2006 at 10:31 am | | Parent | Thread | Reply
yesss! my rhetorics are obviously improving :)
but the question still stands, is the image then of monkeys dressed up the same basically as social gender?
of course it's more complex than that, but I like the metaphor :D
Posted by [info]axa on Nov. 21st, 2006 at 11:32 am | | Parent | Thread | Reply
There is a saying - "When in Rome, do as Romans do"
This, I speculate, also applies to social gender roles which are differently realized in various cultures. So, yes, your dressed-up monkey metaphor is appropriate, but it is not directly connected with your prior statement that there is no true gender. Please define what you meant by the term "true gender".
Currently it seems to me that all genders are true within their respective environments - within the group that has invented and accepted them as being true.
Posted by [info]atiitis on Nov. 21st, 2006 at 11:53 am | | Parent | Thread | Reply
ture as in all encompassing and undeniable gender, it is all fake, so if you don't feel good about your gender you can always change it, it might be hard to do that within a given society, but u don't have to settle if u don't want to...it's just that often people take things for granted since it's the way they were raised to believe the world turns and they feel offended if somebody else tells them that it's not true for them and there are other truths...
...so if everybody is right, then they are also all wrong
Posted by [info]axa on Nov. 21st, 2006 at 04:00 pm | | Parent | Thread | Reply
I concur.
With the help of modern medicine it is even possible to entirely change your sex. Changing your gender should be even more easier, if you wish to do so. Why you would wish to do so is another question entirely. Several reasons spring to my mind at the first glance - starting from simple boredom and ending with some deep childhood trauma. Be that as it may, it only requires your own consent and incentive... as well as the determination to face the disdain of your friends and the public in general, although this may vary depending on the country/region you are in.
Posted by [info]atiitis on Nov. 22nd, 2006 at 10:08 am | | Parent | Reply

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